Loyalist chief appears at west Belfast festival
Thursday, 6 August 2009
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Terrorist leader Jackie McDonald has told an audience in west Belfast that the murder of Coleraine community worker Kevin McDaid “did nothing for loyalism”.
The UDA ‘brigadier’, speaking at a festival event, said he had “every sympathy” for the McDaid family.
McDonald was part of the panel in an event billed West Belfast Youth Talks Back.
The senior loyalist was joined on the platform by republican Sean Murray, PSNI Chief Superintendent Mark Hamilton and Belfast’s Lord Mayor Naomi Long.
There were questions on a range of issues including the McDaid murder, plastic bullets, policing, contentious marches, racism and sectarianism.
On the parades controversy, McDonald claimed Sinn Fein “had a lot to do with orchestrating and organising people into being annoyed”.
There were no questions from the floor on splits within the UDA, nor the recent statement issued by the linked Ulster Political Research Group in north Antrim/ Londonderry withdrawing support for policing and the political institutions.
But McDonald described loyalism as being in a “no man’s land”.
“Unionist politicians don’t know how to deal with loyalists,” he told his audience.
“Republicans have extended the hand of friendship more than the unionist parties,” he said.
Speaking to the Belfast Telegraph afterwards he added: “Unionists don’t know what to do with us.
“They don’t know whether we’re an asset or a problem. People are afraid to make us respectable.
“We are telling unionist politicians that they are going to have to become more involved with loyalist working class people.
“The days of arriving on the doorsteps three weeks before an election are over,” he said.
The loyalist leader continued: “We are telling people they have to register to vote and when it comes the time they have to go out and vote.”
Commenting on the presence of the leading loyalist at yesterday’s event, Danny Morrison of the West Belfast Festival told this newspaper: “I thought it was productive, and a sign of progress — not only his presence but the fact that there were young people from Sandy Row and Lisburn sitting beside young people from Ballymurphy and Twinbrook.
“It’s encouraging that the young audience were prepared to engage,” he said.
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Comments
37 Comments
"The relevance is that solely because the Orange Order doesn`t admit Catholics as members, some posters here accuse the Orange Order of being sectarian."
Because that's what Sectarianism is, Cliff! If I set up an organisation for 'Whites only', that would be racist, wouldn't it? And there'd be outrage!
Posted by What? | 10.08.09, 12:53 GMT
So Cliff, finally someone has admitted that Orangefest is exclusive. All these months with posters commenting on how open and inclusive it is and you just shoot that down with one comment.
Double standards, typical.
Posted by Ulysses32 | 10.08.09, 10:56 GMT
What? says"And what?? What relevance has that? You also have to be Jewish to have a Bar Mitzvah!"
The relevance is that solely because the Orange Order doesn`t admit Catholics as members, some posters here accuse the Orange Order of being sectarian.Orange Orders Parades are open for anyone to attend and many do.
Aussie, if you read my comment correctly you will see that I clearly stated that you have to be a Catholic to be a MEMBER of the Catholic Church. Right or wrong?
Dublin, I have to respect your opinions because at least you and many other Irish Nationalists will actually acknowledge Unionists rights unlike posters like sean who worship at the alter of Gerry Adams.
Posted by Cliff | 08.08.09, 11:32 GMT
Sean, I (like most other Dubliners) am all for a United Ireland if it's what the people up there want. There's no-one more proud to be Irish than I. However, there is a majority up there who, as of now, reject it outright. What are we do? Force them into it? Come on. The English authorities exploited and abused us for hundreds of years, let's not do the same.
Cliff, I stated that "Britishness" was a mythic concept as that's exactly what it is. If one asks an Englishman what he is, he will inevitably respond "English", a Scot will surely say he's "Scottish", same goes for a Welshman. That is why Gordon Brown has tried (and completely failed) to inculcate a sense of "Britishness" to those in mainland Great Britain. For them, it simply doesn't exist.
Of course in NI, things are a little different. There a "British" identity was created between the English and Scottish planters in opposition to the native Irish - it has come to define what they are "not", rather than what they are.
Posted by Dublin(er) | 07.08.09, 13:24 GMT
cliff you are wrong again, you don't have to be a catholic to attend a catholic church as the churhes doors are open to everyone including your self. could you imagine me walking into an orange hall with my irish soccer shirt on.
Posted by aussie from belfast ireland | 06.08.09, 21:12 GMT
typical comment from a Dubliner sure thats why youre called jackins cause ye are more english than the Ulster loyalist, only differance is you wont admit it.
Posted by sean from co down Ireland | 06.08.09, 21:09 GMT
Guys.
As someone connected to neither religious divide i can clearly point out the international viewpoint:
Feile: outward looking - friendly, open, welcoming, encourages debate, new thinking, broadens knowledge, a respected festival.
Orangism: inward looking - protectist, purely anti-Catholic raison d'être, what-we-have-we-hold, triumphalist, blood & thunder, "never never never".
Not hard to see why one side is, as Jackie said, "in no-man's land".
Posted by SM | 06.08.09, 19:36 GMT
Dublin, how does the 'Britishness' of Unionists 'not exist'? They feel British, they identify with the British state, legally they are British.... If it walks like a duck..... The whole concept of nationality is an imagined one, Irish is equally, we are all human beings after all but we each have our own feeelings with regards where their loyalties lie. How is 'Irishness' any more 'real' than Britishness?
Posted by Steve | 06.08.09, 19:12 GMT
Cliff "Mick has a fair point about Sinn Fein acknowledging their role in creating catastrophic events here."
Indeed. But apparently I'm the bigot for suggesting this! Some of the contributors to these pages have been well trained/brain-washed.
You get used to it.
Posted by míck | 06.08.09, 19:09 GMT
Mr. McDonald makes some very good points but I have one question.
How on earth do you make these "mafia" types respectable???
In the area where I live it is commonly known that their leaders are into drug dealing and extortion.
If you speak up you end up being threatened or beaten senseless with baseball bats.
Lord help us if the Unionist people had to rely on Mr. McDonald and his assocates to look after our interests.
Posted by Sams yer man | 06.08.09, 18:48 GMT
"I know you have to be a Protestant to join the Orange Order, but you also have to be a Catholic to be a member of the Catholic Church."
And what?? What relevance has that? You also have to be Jewish to have a Bar Mitzvah!
Posted by What? | 06.08.09, 17:08 GMT
Dublin,
I appreciate that your comments have been made with the utmost sincerity, but to try and tell some of us that who and what we are doesn`t exist is somewhat patronising.Until Nationalists/Republicans get over the fact that there are over 1 million people who live in Northern Ireland who are British, then we will forever go round in circles. I know it is very hard for many Nationalists and Republicans to accept that fact, but it is their failure to do so which has also perpetuated the problems in Northern Ireland.
Posted by Cliff | 06.08.09, 16:58 GMT
good to see i would like to see the o o invite sinn fein members to talk but they never never never will the future is now take advantage of it
Posted by ray .. usa | 06.08.09, 15:36 GMT
Loyalists should be listened to and understood. There is a deep fear running through the community which leads to the vile sectarianism and racism we have seen in evidence these last few months.
They feel under siege so they lash out in the worst ways possible. They're Protestant and Northern Irish let them be proud of that. This attachment to something that doesn't really exist i.e. "Britishness" is at the root of the problem. They're fighting a never ending battle to preserve something which doesn't really exist.
The best solution would be to make N.I. independent. I don't see any way a United Ireland could work even if a majority wanted it up there as it would lead to an incessant IRA type insurgency and we simply don't have the ability nor the desire to cope with it down here.
Let both sides learn to come together and be proud of their shared origins. It's what has happened in the South. Protestant, Catholic and Dissenter are now simply Irish, nothing more, nothing less.
Posted by Dublin | 06.08.09, 15:27 GMT
It would advance inter community dialogue and I believe would be very constructive, if "Orangefest" held a similar roundtable discussion.
Posted by Phil | 06.08.09, 15:25 GMT
Sorry! Apologies to mick, got my names mixed up! Mick has a fair point about Sinn Fein acknowledging their role in creating catastrophic events here.
Posted by Cliff | 06.08.09, 15:19 GMT
I agree that there should be more interaction between the two communities and more discussion type forums of this type.
As for Ulysses32 saying that Orangefest should be all inclusive, Feile should adopt your recommendation. Apart from the discussion which Jackie and Gregory Campbell has in the past attended, that is about as all inclusive as Feile gets. Speak to some of Feile`s neighbours in the Shankill and Woodvale.Orangefest is open for anyone to go to.Yes, I know you have to be a Protestant to join the Orange Order, but you also have to be a Catholic to be a member of the Catholic Church.That`s just the way things are.
Jackie and others should be commended for trying to bring the loyalist viewpoint to Republican areas, but at the same time, I am sure, are very wary of Sinn Fein`s duplicity. We`ll see what materializes.Ulysses32, your continued derogatory comments say it all really.
Posted by Cliff | 06.08.09, 14:56 GMT
Please dont post comments against Ulysses32 Cliff,
as he is alwyas right, arnt you Ulyass
Posted by Sam | 06.08.09, 14:42 GMT
Ger, just a wee point you may have forgotten, while Jackie McDonald brings the message of loyalism to a nationalist event, republicans have been getting their message across to the unionist community for many years as a major part of our government.
Anyhow, let's not focus on the negatives and petty bigotry that tends to seep into every post here, this report is a brilliant step forward in the past ten years, and long may it continue, the more we share together and understand each other the better for our shared future on this island.
Maybe the Orange Order could take note of these events?
Posted by Steven73 | 06.08.09, 14:37 GMT
Sorry, Cliff, I don't see anything wrong in what I said. Could you correct me as I was merely trying to make a statement of fact.
You could check my statement and correct me if I'm wrong but I think you will find that I am correct.
I do accept a positive and I have pointed out that that positive is not an isolated occurence. Such positives should be examples to all as to how we are moving forward.
I apologise for offending you by drawing parallels with Orangefest. Maybe I should not be categorising them together in such a way or, if I have categorised them correctly, maybe you could contact the organisers of next year's festival and have them consider such all-inclusive events.
Your tone and observations in your first sentence unfortunately shows that positive moves within any community would be wasted on you.
I don't particularly have an opinion as who is running Feile nor do I have any particular affinity to them.
Posted by Ulysses32 | 06.08.09, 13:59 GMT
37 Comments